It's one thing when you're married and you set priorities with your spouse about the kids such as family, school, and extra curricular activities. However, what happens when you're not married but dating someone with kids and you aren't in sync about priorities? I wasn't thinking this was anything to write about until three times within one day this subject came up regarding how to handle disagreeing with the priorities of the person you're dating or considering dating. In two out of the three couples the men wanted their kids to be present for a soccer practice instead of spending last minute scheduled quality time with the other parent. The other couple had a different situation, the woman was upset that her boyfriend didn't understand that her child needed to be at soccer practice and he called the coach to say they were going to miss practice to have a family dinner and movie night. The woman had agreed to this in the end but was upset that he didn't understand the importance for her 8 year old daughter to be at the practice. In all cases I found the anger in the women to be about the men not considering the feelings and efforts of the ex wives to take some time to bond. In each case the children involved are 8 and older and have been a part of team sports for years and these exes don't interrupt this process often. These two facts make a difference to me because by then the kids get the idea of team commitment and this "insensitive/manipulative move" isn't happening weekly. As an educator I've had the experience of watching how these choices play out. I also hear how the kids feel about each parent regarding their influence and choices in this matter. It is interesting when the young boys and girls repeat one or both parents view and take it on as their own. Is it really how you'd want your kids to view the other parent? What is it saying about you and your own priorities? What this all came down to in the past couple of days for those involved is how is this guy going to treat the one he loves if there's a game or team practice and the loved one wants family time? The man who canceled the practice is upset because he wonders what kind of person he is considering marrying. He feels that the woman's priorities aren't in the right place and this worries him. He felt the following was the message he wanted to send - Put family before sports and that sports are important but never more important than time with family even if it didn't quite fit the schedule. He also noted there are 12 games, 8 practices and 1 team bonding night so what's wrong with putting family first a couple of times during the season? I would also be concerned if I were to be involved with someone who was showing that a commitment to sports especially practice time, was more important than family time and wasn't supportive of the ex. How would that play out as a blended family and all of the obligatory events? Would we not be a blended family on that day if the event landed on a "practice/game day"? Please do not take this to the extreme...this is about balance. Certainly I don't think you should sign up to be part of team and then not show up for practice and be unreliable about games. But occasionally when a parent is feeling the need to take some quality time with their kids, I do believe that time should take precedence to show that the parent is believing this child is important. By the way, I also applaud the parent who takes the time to realize when their child is in need of special attention and wants to send the message the child matters most.
Savannah,
ReplyDeleteI've been waiting all night for this article. I'm a coach for a boys select soccer team. I was told by three sets of divorced parents that these three boys will be here every other weekend and if we practice on Wed. the kids couldn't play. The father's didn't want their night to be spent at practice. I also have two kids whose parents share 50/50 custody. I had the same response from those fathers. This took me off guard because the male psyche and how it works. In today's life it's a new day and age. Family is what's important and use that time to instill values of commitment. Commitment to a family sends the same message but with better rewards. Remember, I coach a select team and out of this team there are four boys destined for bigger soccer experiences. Without the family time and support, these boys may not have even followed their dream of playing soccer. I know family can happen many times and it doesn't have to happen on practice time for most of the families. Most of the families don't miss more than a few games and practices. Why stress your kid out or make your kid resent the other parent because you are headstrong on being at practice and/or games. You're teaching your child to be extreme, unyielding, and a fanatic in the wrong areas. I know I don't hold the beliefs of many coaches. It's also why there's less stress on the boys on my team and the parents are more involved. There's always a coach on a league who is hardcore and you can join those teams and hope your ex doesn't get a hold of them. What's best for the kid after about age 8 is time with family over a sport but it doesn't have to be one or the other as Savannah said. It can be a balance and if that's the day the ex wants to see their son, so let him/her do it. I'm a divorced dad and this is an assumption coming from experience but I've seen that as soon as the ex makes a move in a positive direction there's the other parent criticizing how it's done. It's no wonder the couple is divorced. Also, Savannah, You should be very concerned if you find a man who is upset by this choice of their ex because their true relationship issues and colors are showing.
I dated a woman with kids and I didn't have any. I changed my own sports days and times to be with her and her kids. I wouldn't do it any other way. Great point about blended families. How can you count on a man or woman who is teaching their child the sports and word to a team is more important than their role in a family. These are kids not adults. The adults and their wishes should be dictating the course not a demanding coach, controlling parent, or a whiny ex, be an adult and make the best decision for your child. I do think if you feel your best decision for your child is to play the game then write out the pros and cons. Don't decide what day or night it could have been rearranged to but take it for what it's worth and compare the pros and cons as if there was no other day for it to happen. I'd bet every time the pros will come out for the family unless the intrusion happens often.
ReplyDeleteOn Father's Day you find all teams present in full, on Mother's day the teams are all present if the players are afraid of the coaches response and that's the players moms really. I'm a female coach for boys soccer all year. I put an end to games on Mother's Day and soon will be successful at putting Father's Day on the list. Most people have extended families with grandparents who are being recognized and don't want to spend that day at a field. Maybe it's the downturned economy causing a retro turn to family time and honoring grandparents and parents in general. There has been a majority of requests for equal time. Father's want to be with their dad's and not on a field or on the bleachers. I never thought I'd feel any of this since I grew up as a star in girls fast pitch softball but time is short and the message we send as a parent toward the ex is crucial. We are the only ones who can undue the damage done by the divorce. If one parent is challenged by a child in the family then the other parent needs to be supportive and not make the effort less important than a game. Shame on any parent man or woman who would do that.
ReplyDeleteWhen I started the post I wanted to write in right away and talk about the importance of a team and how dare any parent who scheduled their child on a team to take the child out. I guess I'm "hardcore". Then I read on and saw it was about balance and when you put the numbers out there, it probably is only a few times compared to the season schedule and there's nothing wrong with that. We do take sick days, personal days, and vacation days from work and we sign a contract there to be present. It's okay really to miss a game or two and practice or two especially if it's to take time to be with a parent trying to either repair a relationship or strengthen an already great one. It shows that you don't have to take life so seriously but you do need to take the family serious. It's all about family values the other lessons learned from being part of a team come through in other areas of life as a kid too. Think about it there plenty of kids who get being part of a team who never play sports. So I changed my mind. Good discussion. I wouldn't date a man like this either it wouldn't work with my family or me.
ReplyDeleteThese are divorced families are you kidding me! Of course the child should put the sports second there's hardly enough time anyway. I don't have good time management skills so if the day I decide to take my kids and do something special I will cancel my kids being there. I don't give what anyone thinks. I only have to answer to my kids. If my ex made me feel bad in front of my kids I'd have him thinking about how that borders on brainwashing a child to view this move the way he did. It's emotional abuse the kids learn from their parent. I'm not a great mom and I don't pretend to be but when I do get my act together I expect it taken into consideration and expect support from my ex. My ex would rather be the one who supported my efforts than the ex who didn't. He didn't support my efforts when married and that's why I left so it's good he does it now.
ReplyDeleteSavannah,
ReplyDeleteI want to marry the man who took his girlfriend's daughter out to have a family and movie night. If he becomes available he's just the guy for me.
Who ever wants to marry the man who did this for his girlfriend's daughter will have to stand in line because I think women all over would want him and isn't it too bad he's wasting he's time with a woman who didn't appreciate it? So so sad.
ReplyDeleteI'm so into this man but not into his team ethic. He's hypocritical because he'll take off work to get caught up at home or take off work because he wanted a head start on the weekend or take a day off to be at a kids activity. Why not have a kid take off to be at an adult activity? Why not let a kid get a head start on the weekend or their homework? We don't teach our kids the right priorities. I put in a search family time plus relationships plus kids sports and found this site. I think when I start searching on how to get along with a man who thinks sports is mandatory and family time is second maybe even third, it's time to leave. The world is changing and families are spending more family time together according to the articles I read leading me here. I don't have much to say about it being an ex except I came from a divorced family and even though my parents couldn't stand the sight of each other, my parents supported each other's efforts to be there for me and my sister. I think it's nice you pointed out it isn't every time that this happens so even more of a reason it should be a supportive decision to remind the kids that family is more important than any team unless you want the team to be his or her family over you. At least there would be a lot of people at the funeral.
ReplyDeleteA special co worker of mine taught me that you can't take back those decisions and words. You have to live with the message it sends to the kids. Her ex passed away and if the kids could have had that one moment of bonding out of nowhere it would have made them feel important and worth something. She also reminded me that if divorced I'm the only one who can show my children how to care about someone you can't get along with and how to support someone's effort because it's the right thing to do instead of degregating the ex because you don't like your ex.
ReplyDeleteBoth parties probably see irony in this situation. The ONE time the ex comes through with being a good parent is on the ONE day there's practice or a game. Or, the other parent is thinking I can't believe I finally came up with a stepping stone to a bigger picture to bond with my kid and my ex is going to split hairs over it. I like the pro and con idea because there is no con to this happening periodically. Seriously, are you the kind of person who feels a child has a non-optional comittment in life. What is the downside of these kids going with the ex or boyfriend? What is the downside of knowing the parent or boyfriend wasn't supported? I know I'd feel like I was the parent who wanted my kid at the practice and I wasn't being supported because my ex wanted to take my kid for the night but do you realize how bizarre that really sounds? It sounds awful and to others it sounds egotistical like you should matter more than your kid. If your kid would rather be at the game than with the parent then that is even more of a reason to make your kid be with the parent and start making it more of a tradition too. It should come first.
ReplyDeleteIf there was ever a time to see the one you love for what he or she is pay attention to how they treat the ex. It goes both ways and I would be concerned if I wasn't supported whether I wanted my child to follow through with a team or I wanted my child with me. These decisions and intensity should be figured out before the child is signed up. I know I would disagree with how much time my kids was in sports compared to family but my ex knows this and takes deep breaths when I pull him. At least it's understood by all even the coach that my son will be there but family is first. I know my ex hates it but I love my ex for understanding and standing by me knowing he needs to come to my side because it doesn't make sense to say to our son, "hey go play and you'll spend that time tomorrow." How about see your mom and next week you'll be there.
ReplyDeleteThere are lots of ways to spend time with the family and it's easy to see that the choices made were a conflict of interest. Is the problem the conflict of interest? I think it's an issue because everyone is missing the point. In each of these situations or at least two out of three there was an ex involved and the time with the other parent should be honored over a practice as long as this only happens on few and far between occasions. Another idea about divorced parents is that whichever parent's weekend it is that parent decides and really doesn't have to ask or tell the other parent what activity that parent is pulling the child from because it's their right as the parent during their visitation/custody time. The only time this parent needs to say something is if the other parent was planning on showing up. Family time isn't something you schedule all of the time. Family time is something that happens and gets fit in and scheduled. It's the non supporting exes I worry about. The boyfriend who wanted to show his possible future step child that she was important to him and to her mom is a big big deal. I'm sure they have lots of family time but to send the message that it's more important than any sport can only be done by removing a practice or a game. Not all of the time but some of the time. It's healthy and teaches a form of finding balance.
ReplyDeleteThe word "honored" is being tossed around and I don't like it. You don't honor the time or the person you accept it. I don't honor anything like this since it's a parent acting like a parent. You don't honor it you celebrate it. We live in a world where sons and daughters are being raised more by one parent over the other and you celebrate it whan any parent says pay attention to me because I'm wanting your attention.
ReplyDeleteSavannah,
ReplyDeleteThis has been posted for a few days and I was wondering if any of these couples keep up with your site and the comments? If the people visit here what have they said about the responses?
A couple of the comments revolve around easier said than done regarding supporting ex spouses. The men did admit from the beginning that their responses weren't the most supportive and one apologized to the ex. As far as the woman who was upset at her boyfriend...even though she talks about him like a husband she decided this wasn't his call as a boyfriend. She does agree that the time is important and the lesson to show that too much emphasis is put on a sport, is well understood. She plans on taking her daughter out for family time one night a month. She also says she isn't going to sign her daughter up for any sport that practices on a weekend or a team that plays more than one game a week. If there's a make up game she said she might not commit to it since it's a make up game that wasn't agreed to.
ReplyDeleteSavannah Jones
I"m a former little league baseball coach and I'm divorced. I felt like I had some disease because I called practices on Friday nights. I had my son on Fridays. This was a mistake and the older the boys get the more they resent playing sports on Friday nights. There's too many other things going on like girls at malls and movies with friends. Then, the high school sports set in and a father wonders why he had his son playing sports on a Friday night or most of the time was spent around sports and now I miss my high school son who will leave for college in two years. When a parent says,"where did the time go?" Drive by a field and ask yourself could I have balanced this better? I believe in sports I regret that I thought I gave my son what he wanted which was to play sports but if I had taught him to want to be with his family more than the sport, the sport would have been for fun and the family would have been more of everything else. I know my ideals and my dismissal of my ex wifes attempts and calling those attempts lame, got in the way of our marriage. I do have regrets which are clear and I'm living with those but like the message sent through these comments.
ReplyDeleteI'm involved with a woman in her mid 40's and her kids are college bound. My kids are middle school age and eventually will be college bound. I am not included in a lot of future decisions but would like to be. I was told by a friend that I don't like when she butts in my business with the kids and ex and it's why she probably doesn't include me in her kids business of the real nature. I know her ex boyfriend spent a lot of time giving his advice and opinion and she listened to it and would seek it. I feel very left out and unimportant. I don't invite her to my kids games and don't even know if she'll go. I don't include her in dinners when she doesn't have her kids and I have mine. I feel my kids want time with me without her even though my kids like her. She has more free time than I do and I don't have know where I'm going with this but what about supporting each other and our kids? I'm feeling disconnected and it worsened when I found out the ex boyfriend stepped in to help and I wasn't asked.
ReplyDeleteI met a woman in Starbucks. She was talking to the cashier and I introduced myself. The important part of this is she was asked why she's alone and why some guy was with her only now and then. Her answer was that he didn't have his kids. The cashier asked if this meant he had his kids and he did. I told her to go out and have some fun, go dancing, shop, and mix it up. She looked younger than she is which explained the laugh at my suggestions. She was happy with her laptop and scouring this site. I sat with her while she showed me around the site. It was obvious to me that if you missed a day in the life of this woman you missed out. I wanted to ask her out but instead gave her my phone number. She didn't offer hers and you could tell she wouldn't. This to me fits in here is because of finding out when to be there for another person. Her ex isn't an issue but this other man's ex that the cashier was talking about is and I didn't get a final answer and wanted to ask if this guy was like this with his ex and didn't know how to make it all work. Should a person ask someone out in this situation? I know that doesn't fit in but don't know where to make it fit.
ReplyDeleteCan you go overboard with this idea? Savannah, I live in your home state and tonight was a special night for my daughter. I saw ex spouses, exes with new partners, and married couples take part in this event. I begged my ex husband to understand that this only happens once and we should all be there. The whole family should be there which includes my son. My son had a baseball game and my ex took him to the game using the excuse that he's the coach. I saw the other coach at the event with his son and there to watch his daughter with his ex wife and her new husband. I'm being pissy because you only get this one night and we if don't make big deals about these special events then we sen the wrong message about what and who is important for which parent. We don't take turns being parents because we're divorced or we shouldn't but we do. When my daughter came home she told her dad all about the event but I think far into the years and how will this be played over in their heads? Will it be my sons game was more important than an event? What if my ex and I aren't around anymore, will my son know to give up moments in his life to be there for special events in his daughters life and will she see this same in reverse? What about what message we sent that he's more important than his sister so will he do this to his son and daughter? What I am saying is for one night every now and then concede and be a family. Not family night quality time. We have enough of that but drop everything and make the event that's once in a lifetime and celebrate it together. Savannah you would understand this, you don't know how many of those times you'll have left. I had my kids late in life and I know these moments are limited. My ex looks old to me and I think it's because he thinks he's doing right by the kids but in his heart knows this isn't right.
ReplyDeleteI'm a widow and when I see parents choose sports over family time that didn't work around the schedule I feel sorry for those people and mainly their children. If my late husband could still be here he'd still make the right decisions. We didn't know we'd have little time with him but we lived our life like sports was important but completely second to anything else. We taught our children to be committed to family and that' their team. Thank the moon for doing this because these kids are the ones that got us through the passing of their own father. We were together the whole time. We didn't have warning it just came to be. If my sons had been at my grandkids games instead of with me I wouldn't have forgiven them but I would have tried because I would have been responsible for teaching them the bad choice. I'm glad I did this my way and not some controlling manipulative mans way who says sports are mandatory and family will wait until it's over.
ReplyDeleteI used to believe that if a man was there for his kids this was the man for me but this really is too much. These men should have let their ex wives take the kids and skip the game. It only happens infrequently. I'm not into guys who keep putting too much emphasis on this parenting part of life. Don't get me wrong I'm really turned on by a great dad but if the guy can't balance it when he's into you then he's not going to balance it when he's used to you. My friend can't connect as more than a good friend because of the guys kids but she's dated a man with kids before and they were glued together mind, body and soul. She can have that again with her old boyfriend or she could have that with her friend but even from an outsiders point of view he can't balance his kids with his own life or he sends the message he wants to which to my friend is if you need me more than this than you need someone else. We told her to start dating and find someone else. Her time is now why not? I have been reading this string and think there are selfish people mad at exes but also teaching their children to be selfish adults by not letting them or making them go with the other parent for family time. We make these kids the center of our lives and wonder why as teens and young adults these kids are all about themselves. Some of these adults haven't grown up and are sending what looks like a grown up message to the kids but really is sending an immature one.
ReplyDeleteSomeone wrote in about being there for one kid and a special event and being there for the other younger or older sibling too. I think it was a daughter and son you just posted this story. What happened to teaching kids with siblings to be there for the other sibling? THat's both parents job not one on one night and the other on another night. We take turns but part of being a family is everyone goes and celebrates not continue to do your thing while I do mine. No wonder these selfish men are divorced and their exes probably learned to dish it back out to these men. It's the kids that suffer and the bad seed continues because you train these little ones to only care about themself.
ReplyDeleteThis advice or story is for the guy who doesn't know where he fits in and being supportive with an ex boyfriend hanging around.
ReplyDeleteI'm an ex boyfriend and know that sounds off beat but let me explain: I'm an ex boyfriend to a woman who went through difficult times while we were together and sometimes I added to the stress. I feel an obligation to take care of her until someone steps up and does it. I inquire, I gently push, I ask straight up if there's anyone in her life. I get the same reply, "there's somewhat a someone but he doesn't make himself fit and doesn't step up like you did and still do." Understand we have a great love and respect for one another and when I hear this I don't think it's my chance to date her again because that ship has sailed. I believe it's saying this isn't the right man. I used to not want to push myself on anyone and I didn't on this woman it came naturally for some reason with her. Man, my advice is to include her if she doesn't have her kids and make the time on your own. I couldn't schedule anything with this woman when life got chaotic but I was part of the schedule. Hard to explain this but she was part of mine and I was part of hers and not on an unoccupied by kids day or night, it was any time. My ex girlfriend links these articles to me everytime there's a man wanting more but not knowing how to get it. This isn't the woman's problem this is yours.